Is MFE really a better choice than MSc Statistics ?(Math bachelor)

Aria LIU

Aria LIU

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I am an undergraduate student major in Mathematics (minor in business). I am considering applying for masters in North America.
MFE is a very hot trend among Chinese students. Does MFE really bring a promising future for Chinese students?
How about Master of Science in Statistics? Anyone can share some job market information about that?
 
So exited to see Canteen B in the profile photo. Wooh! wooh!

I will vote for those top MFE programs for sure. From what I heard , most of those who got a MFE in the end landed jobs with BB FO or buy-side firms, after they came back from the US.

IMHO, masters of stats are more likely to be working on business analytics stuff. Those firms who need statisticians would easily find a perfect candidate from a huge pool of stats PHDs.

The fact is that I am a junior student so what I said could be biased.:) Just another sample point in the training set. lol.
 
Well not really.

1. Typically most chinese students would want to get into places with the highest barrier of entry. MFE is one of them. There is a very competitive culture among them.

2. ROI is decent. They have no qualms about spending their parent's money in expensive classes. Most of them are afterall the only child and gem in the family.

3. China's financial economy is booming. Enrolling in finance lessons is a wise choice. Most of them plan to return right after studies in the US.

4. If you want to stay in the US, getting a STEM degree helps. MFE falls under this category.

Ultimately US visa regulations for international students state that one have to work in their field of studies. So pick a course that could land you your dream job, instead of following the trend.
 
zyuan said:
So exited to see Canteen B in the profile photo. Wooh! wooh!

I will vote for those top MFE programs for sure. From what I heard , most of those who got a MFE in the end landed jobs with BB FO or buy-side firms, after they came back from the US.

IMHO, masters of stats are more likely to be working on business analytics stuff. Those firms who need statisticians would easily find a perfect candidate from a huge pool of stats PHDs.

The fact is that I am a junior student so what I said could be biased.:) Just another sample point in the training set. lol.
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Wow so happy to see a schoolmate here! Are you considering to become a quant? I think more than 60% of my Chinese friends want to enter financial industry in Singapore. I held the same view at my 3rd year too.

However I stayed in some not so financial city in North America for a year and kindly changed my mind. Seems for MFE graduates, "Go big or go home" not only applies to choosing schools but also applies to choosing cities.

For those US Tier 2 MFE graduates, will they find good positions in Singapore?
 
Keith Tan said:
Well not really.

1. Typically most chinese students would want to get into places with the highest barrier of entry. MFE is one of them. There is a very competitive culture among them.

2. ROI is decent. They have no qualms about spending their parent's money in expensive classes. Most of them are afterall the only child and gem in the family.

3. China's financial economy is booming. Enrolling in finance lessons is a wise choice. Most of them plan to return right after studies in the US.

4. If you want to stay in the US, getting a STEM degree helps. MFE falls under this category.

Ultimately US visa regulations for international students state that one have to work in their field of studies. So pick a course that could land you your dream job, instead of following the trend.
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I think your first 3 points exactly explains the hot trend among Chinese students! Cannot agree more.

May I ask what is STEM? I haven't learned about it.

And how is the career market in Canada, without considering Working Permit?
 
Why not try to get a Singaporean govt scholarship which would mean a secured job in Singapore for a few years after the master degree?
Singapore has a much matured financial market than China which is a lot better than starting your career in China.

Stats is more versatile and you can apply the skills in many industry while MFE is very niche and if you graduate in a down market, you are very unlikely to not get a job and get stuck with a big loan. If you are determined to go that way, be prepared for jobs in risk, regulation, mid office type, etc instead of the long gone trading jobs.
 
Andy Nguyen said:
Why not try to get a Singaporean govt scholarship which would mean a secured job in Singapore for a few years after the master degree?
Singapore has a much matured financial market than China which is a lot better than starting your career in China.

Stats is more versatile and you can apply the skills in many industry while MFE is very niche and if you graduate in a down market, you are very unlikely to not get a job and get stuck with a big loan. If you are determined to go that way, be prepared for jobs in risk, regulation, mid office type, etc instead of the long gone trading jobs.
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For the government scholarship do you mean tuition grant? Actually that one is not a very good deal if you don't want to stay after graduation, you need to pay all back at 4.25%.

I learned that Singapore has good employment rates so I am conservative about applying MFE in US, maybe staying in Singapore is a better choice. Besides, by entering my own university's MFE program I can save the effort and time to do sth else.

Another question, if I study Statistics and acquire some finance background(like CFA level2 or FRM), is it possible to find some positions like mid office or risk management? in US , in Singapore
 
Aria LIU said:
MFE is a very hot trend among Chinese students. Does MFE really bring a promising future for Chinese students?
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Everything I've learned from talking to Wall St people and headhunters suggests that an MFE is not really particularly valued versus an MS in a subject like Statistics. MFE is an indicator of particular interests, but someone with MS in Statistics can easily demonstrate a similar set of interests via a master's thesis or coursework or just extracurricular activities. Anyone capable will be offered first round interviews, which will be a heavy determinant of deciding whether the person is interested and knowledgable about finance.

Each degree comes with its own baggage and therefore has its pros and cons. M.S. is often seen as a more "academic" degree while MFE is "professional". Basically you know how a lot of people think PhD is very smart but MBA is just a good bullshitter? Well, it turns out there's a similar and prevalent attitude about MS versus MFE. Latter is seen more like a career-oriented person... maybe not that good at math or statistics or programming really, but ambitious and interested in making lots of money. While MS is perceived as actually interested in science, math, etc. because they have some talent for it.

So to answer the question succinctly, "does MFE really bring a promising future for Chinese students?" The short answer is "no". The longer answer is "yes, but for students who would have an equally brighter, if not brighter future, with an MS or PhD in science, math, or statistics". In the end, people will look at your real skills. And I imagine any bright Chinese student would benefit far more from an environment that is built around learning, and not so much about competing and networking.
 
Aria LIU said:
Wow so happy to see a schoolmate here! Are you considering to become a quant? I think more than 60% of my Chinese friends want to enter financial industry in Singapore. I held the same view at my 3rd year too.

However I stayed in some not so financial city in North America for a year and kindly changed my mind. Seems for MFE graduates, "Go big or go home" not only applies to choosing schools but also applies to choosing cities.

For those US Tier 2 MFE graduates, will they find good positions in Singapore?
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:)I am not very into being a quant . That job to some extent needs hard math and requires a PhD degree in most cases. From my research, some MFEs in Singapore went to Market Risk. So probably I will aim at that kind of jobs.

If I didn't wrongly understand what you said, you do not have to work in Singapore after graduation, right? Then why bother coming back to Singapore? Those MFE candidates from tier 2 programs surely have lots of chances to land their dream jobs in North America. I am not very sure abt if they can find a good job in Singapore since there seems to be very few samples.

All the best!
 
zyuan said:
:)I am not very into being a quant . That job to some extent needs hard math and requires a PhD degree in most cases. From my research, some MFEs in Singapore went to Market Risk. So probably I will aim at that kind of jobs.

If I didn't wrongly understand what you said, you do not have to work in Singapore after graduation, right? Then why bother coming back to Singapore? Those MFE candidates from tier 2 programs surely have lots of chances to land their dream jobs in North America. I am not very sure abt if they can find a good job in Singapore since there seems to be very few samples.

All the best!
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Risk control is also a great area for a female from MFE, as told by my Operating Research course professor. And I indeed have a senior from NTU MFE who is doing risk management now.

Its just too bothersome to apply for so many programs and adopting to a new country.......seems I am the least ambitious person in this forum.
 
Aria LIU said:
where are you talking about, in US or in China?
plus, big banks' back office is still an IT job
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Not sure what your point is. Plenty of back office is not IT. And plenty of IT roles at an IB are as lucrative and less stressful than the risk roles you seem interested in.
 
Aria LIU said:
Risk control is also a great area for a female from MFE, as told by my Operating Research course professor. And I indeed have a senior from NTU MFE who is doing risk management now.

Its just too bothersome to apply for so many programs and adopting to a new country.......seems I am the least ambitious person in this forum.
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Well, thanks for that information! You effort surely pays off in the end!

Aria LIU said:
where are you talking about, in US or in China?
plus, big banks' back office is still an IT job
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I think IntoDarkness was saying about US. I also did see a few PRC guys in US who got into IBD, S&T positions in BB.
 
C S said:
Not sure what your point is. Plenty of back office is not IT. And plenty of IT roles at an IB are as lucrative and less stressful than the risk roles you seem interested in.
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I agree that operation and IT positions indeed have good salary and are less stressful, but they have higher chances to be laid off and also, there aren't as many positions as before opening under such an economy.
In addition, it makes no sense for either MFE or Stat MSc to enter back office.
 
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