Profile evaluation: am I wasting my time?

[zyz]

Hello Quantnet,

I am currently contemplating applying for MFE/MFin programs and would like to know if I have a chance at all given my non-quant background.

Profile:
BSc Management from top Uni in no name country;
MSc Risk Management from a Russell Group Uni in UK;
Been working as a Market Risk analyst at no name EM Bank for 2 years (also have 1 year BO experience);
Passed CFA Level 1;

I have 2 more years to get things organized and be ready for application process. What I am planning to do is:

1) take (free?) online math refresher courses (Calc I-III), Linear Algebra;
2) get C++ certification/learn Python;
3) crush GMAT/GRE;
4) sign up for Pre-MFE programs, do my best and try to convince Adcom;

I know it is easier said than done, but what do you guys think?

 

[Dave Lee]

Your profile will be fine for some MFin programs such as JHU or WU (Corporate track)...but for MFE, you will have a long way to go

 

[zyz]

Thanks for the input.
I was just wondering if there is any hope for more quanty programs like MIT's MFin and the likes ... Am I still dreaming?

 

[Dave Lee]

Thanks for the input.
I was just wondering if there is any hope for more quanty programs like MIT's MFin and the likes ... Am I still dreaming?

I don't know about MIT. I have a friend who got in MIT's program last year without a strong quant background, but she had two internships with a big name accounting firm in HK. Since you have 2 yrs working exp, why not give it a shot? If you can bump up with proper quant background, I guess you should try Berkeley as well.

 

[moretodo]

If you can bump up with proper quant background, I guess you should try Berkeley as well.

Berkeley would be a long shot for you in my opinion. The application fees is 275 USD since they apparently hire the Queen of England to review the profiles and is too much for a person who has a low probability of making the cut to make it a worthwhile investment.

 

[zyz]

Queen of England, haha

So, what I understand from the replies is probably it will be really difficult and its time to get real and consider less quant-heavy MFin or MBA ...

Thank you all.

 

[MRoss]

I disagree strongly.

If you are passionate about MFE then give it your all and you will succeed. Getting in to a good program is much like applying for a job. Learn what they look for, try to look like it, and network your brains off. Have someone introduce you to a member of the application committee. If you approach MFE application like you would fighting for a million dollar prize you will get in. It's all about devotion.

 

[New Trader]

That's great info. I could talk to someone in the admission committee even before I apply. I guess it is very imporatnt to have a personal connection to get you anywhere?

 

[MRoss]

I guess it is very important to have a personal connection to get you anywhere?

Yes.

 

[MNRC]

Here is a pretty much guaranteed way to get into any top MFE/MFin program: ace the Math Subject GRE test as well as the General GRE quantitative section. Then develop some trading strategies that consistently work (or do your best and demonstrate this clearly in your application essay). These schools mostly just want to know that you can handle the coursework and will not flunk out of their program. And that you will make the program look good later when you go on to consistently beat out George Soros's returns every year. But basically, the more you can demonstrate that you will excel in their program, the more eager they are to accept you. Contacting a professor who works in an area you're interested in will also help in getting you accepted, but because these are not PhD programs your ability to do research doesn't really matter.

Look at it from these schools' perspective. Because this is a terminal professional master's it is basically just a money-maker for these universities. The most they can get out of you really is money and anybody can give them money, so they are looking for students that can handle the coursework and not flunk out of the program. That is key. CMU, Baruch, and Columbia will have intellectually challenging, difficult curricula, so demonstrating that you have what it takes to do well in their programs and graduate on time will go a long way in impressing the admissions committee. Also, selling yourself in any other way to them will help. Put yourself in the committee's shoes and market yourself to them--what kind of student do they want? Go be that student.

 

[zyz]

Here is a pretty much guaranteed way to get into any top MFE/MFin program: ace the Math Subject GRE test as well as the General GRE quantitative section. Then develop some trading strategies that consistently work (or do your best and demonstrate this clearly in your application essay). These schools mostly just want to know that you can handle the coursework and will not flunk out of their program. And that you will make the program look good later when you go on to consistently beat out George Soros's returns every year. But basically, the more you can demonstrate that you will excel in their program, the more eager they are to accept you. Contacting a professor who works in an area you're interested in will also help in getting you accepted, but because these are not PhD programs your ability to do research doesn't really matter.

Look at it from these schools' perspective. Because this is a terminal professional master's it is basically just a money-maker for these universities. The most they can get out of you really is money and anybody can give them money, so they are looking for students that can handle the coursework and not flunk out of the program. That is key. CMU, Baruch, and Columbia will have intellectually challenging, difficult curricula, so demonstrating that you have what it takes to do well in their programs and graduate on time will go a long way in impressing the admissions committee. Also, selling yourself in any other way to them will help. Put yourself in the committee's shoes and market yourself to them--what kind of student do they want? Go be that student.

Pretty interesting comment, appreciated.

I wonder whether this is from your experience or not. As I have stated above, I am a Market Risk analyst and probably I will have to demonstrate my capabilities by achieving something in this area for two reasons:

1) developing trading strategies is completely alien to me at the moment (I am not too sure about being able to beat HF's returns as well);
2) I already have some experience in Risk Management and it would be easier stick with it while improving my quant skills (Math/Programming);

But I do understand the point you are making.

 

[C S]

Hello Quantnet,

I am currently contemplating applying for MFE/MFin programs and would like to know if I have a chance at all given my non-quant background.

Profile:
BSc Management from top Uni in no name country;
MSc Risk Management from a Russell Group Uni in UK;
Been working as a Market Risk analyst at no name EM Bank for 2 years (also have 1 year BO experience);
Passed CFA Level 1;

I have 2 more years to get things organized and be ready for application process. What I am planning to do is:

1) take (free?) online math refresher courses (Calc I-III), Linear Algebra;
2) get C++ certification/learn Python;
3) crush GMAT/GRE;
4) sign up for Pre-MFE programs, do my best and try to convince Adcom;

I know it is easier said than done, but what do you guys think?

I see a lot above about preparing for applying, rather than preparing for your career. You need to do the latter. If you focus on the former, even if you got into a top MFE program, you'll not learn that much and find your lack of skills (and I mean things like attitude of how to leverage your knowledge base, approach to learning things etc) a big handicap in the job search.

You need to prepare for your career NOW. Then use your degree program as a way to network, learn about the business, and take advantage of internship opportunities and placement services. Don't rely on your program to turn you from a quant wannabe to a quant. It ain't gonna happen.

 

[zyz]

I see a lot above about preparing for applying, rather than preparing for your career. You need to do the latter. If you focus on the former, even if you got into a top MFE program, you'll not learn that much and find your lack of skills (and I mean things like attitude of how to leverage your knowledge base, approach to learning things etc) a big handicap in the job search.

You need to prepare for your career NOW. Then use your degree program as a way to network, learn about the business, and take advantage of internship opportunities and placement services. Don't rely on your program to turn you from a quant wannabe to a quant. It ain't gonna happen.

Probably a dumb request, but could you elaborate a bit on "prepare for your career" part? What do you mean by that? How someone who is planning to become a quant risk manager could execute this task properly? If RM is not your area of expertise, I would appreciate any other example so I could relate to it.

Thanks.

 

[MNRC]

Pretty interesting comment, appreciated.

I wonder whether this is from your experience or not. As I have stated above, I am a Market Risk analyst and probably I will have to demonstrate my capabilities by achieving something in this area for two reasons:

1) developing trading strategies is completely alien to me at the moment (I am not too sure about being able to beat HF's returns as well);
2) I already have some experience in Risk Management and it would be easier stick with it while improving my quant skills (Math/Programming);

But I do understand the point you are making.

Yes, this is from my personal experience. I study CS in grad school at a major university and have friends in the math dept and also know people studying for the MFin degree (in the top 10). They tell me this. The CS and math depts have overlapping professors and courses, so I have some idea of what the admissions committee is looking for. If I were you, I would be trying to put myself in the admissions committee's shoes and figure out what they are looking for, then take the steps to give them what they want. This is important. Getting into a good grad program even in CS has opened up tons of doors (interview invitations for quant and software developer roles from KCG, Citibank, Two Sigma, Highbridge, Google, Facebook, etc.) I haven't gotten any offers mostly because I'm not that hot a programmer, but it's great to know that I can get an interview with them if I apply through school. Some, like SIG, have approached me out of the blue (without me contacting them) mostly because they thought I'm graduating next May. Unfortunately, it's going to be another year before I complete degree requirements.

I think working on your career and developing the right skills are very important. But it's not worth much if companies don't want to talk to you. For that you need to get into a good school and interview through your school.