University of Illinois at Urbana Champaign MSFE vs. University of Minnesota MFM

University of Illinois at Urbana Champaign MSFE vs. University of Minnesota MFM

  • UIUC MSFE

    Votes: 14 93.3%
  • UMN MFM

    Votes: 1 6.7%

  • Total voters
    15
Joined
9/18/13
Messages
74
Points
18
Hi,

I have got admits from the UIUC and UMn. Now, I m highly confused how to decide between the two. I have already paid tuition deposit for UIUC but UMn is alo good. Following are the criteria on which I want to decide:

1. Overall course expenses: UIUC is very expensive as compared to UMn
2. Internships
3. Job after graduation
4. Reputation of the college in financial industry: I want to work on WallStreet but couldn't somehow got into New York colleges, so in that terms

Please recommend

Thanks
 
I request you guys to please support your choice with reason. That will be of better help
 
I request you guys to please support your choice with reason. That will be of better help

Something to keep in mind a propos the USA: you never get more than you pay for (though you may end up getting a great deal less in this nation of con men and hucksters). U of M is inexpensive for a reason: the program sucks. I doubt they can arrange decent internships or placements. Minneapolis is a nothing place. The teaching in the program is nothing to write home about. So you can save a few dollars by going to U of M -- but it's false economy. The decision, of course, is entirely yours. Speaking more generally, a couple of posters have pointed out that going to any program not in the top seven is a dicey proposition. Coming from abroad, spending tens of thousands of dollars -- and then not getting a post-graduation placement ... something to ponder, to fret about, to spend sleepless nights over, tossing and turning.
 
Something to keep in mind a propos the USA: you never get more than you pay for (though you may end up getting a great deal less in this nation of con men and hucksters). U of M is inexpensive for a reason: the program sucks. I doubt they can arrange decent internships or placements. Minneapolis is a nothing place. The teaching in the program is nothing to write home about. So you can save a few dollars by going to U of M -- but it's false economy. The decision, of course, is entirely yours. Speaking more generally, a couple of posters have pointed out that going to any program not in the top seven is a dicey proposition. Coming from abroad, spending tens of thousands of dollars -- and then not getting a post-graduation placement ... something to ponder, to fret about, to spend sleepless nights over, tossing and turning.
Thanks for the reply! I understand that going into a school other than top 7 is a risky proposition, but the point is I couldn't get into those schools, so there is no option. Now keeping this point of yours in mind, shouldn't I consider UIUC and UMN equivalent as both of them are not top 7 (both ranked 20) and in both the cases I'll have to work really hard to get a desired placement. If it's such a dicey issue then should I invest so much in UIUC (whose fee structure is almost same as Columbia)? My only concern is, if the schools are not much different in terms of job after graduation then, fees must be an important criteria
 
Thanks for the reply! I understand that going into a school other than top 7 is a risky proposition, but the point is I couldn't get into those schools, so there is no option. Now keeping this point of yours in mind, shouldn't I consider UIUC and UMN equivalent as both of them are not top 7 (both ranked 20) and in both the cases I'll have to work really hard to get a desired placement. If it's such a dicey issue then should I invest so much in UIUC (whose fee structure is almost same as Columbia)? My only concern is, if the schools are not much different in terms of job after graduation then, fees must be an important criteria

I don't know what the fees currently are for these two programs. U of M just cross off your list immediately -- you're wasting your time and money, converting hope and cash into dust and ash. With regard to UIUC, ask for placement rates, try to get a handle on where their graduates are going after completion. Placements are everything. If you're not satisfied with the responses and can't get in to the top programs, then "think outside the box." Think of European programs, which generally don't cost an arm and a leg. With regard to Wall Street, the situation is becoming, "Many are called, few are chosen." Think of your situation as analogous to a chess game where your position is far from ideal -- it's wanting, it's inferior, and you're under pressure -- but you still have to make the most accurate moves simply to survive.
 
I tried to find out placement statistics for both the schools. UMN's director gave me the link: http://www.math.umn.edu/finmath/faq/
and asked me to read Q12, Q41

In case of UIUC, the reply goes like this: Placement for 2011, 2012, 2013 are 100%, 98%, and 65% respectively. 2013 students graduated at the end of year. According to her, it is expected to have placement >90% in the 180 days of graduation. Around 50% of the alumni work in the US and average placement salaries for those who get job in US is USD 75,000 without bonus. She didn't give any stats about internship
 
I tried to find out placement statistics for both the schools. UMN's director gave me the link: http://www.math.umn.edu/finmath/faq/
and asked me to read Q12, Q41

In case of UIUC, the reply goes like this: Placement for 2011, 2012, 2013 are 100%, 98%, and 65% respectively. 2013 students graduated at the end of year. According to her, it is expected to have placement >90% in the 180 days of graduation. Around 50% of the alumni work in the US and average placement salaries for those who get job in US is USD 75,000 without bonus. She didn't give any stats about internship
Now, can you help me interpreting this response from both the directors?
 
In case of UIUC, the reply goes like this: Placement for 2011, 2012, 2013 are 100%, 98%, and 65% respectively. 2013 students graduated at the end of year. According to her, it is expected to have placement >90% in the 180 days of graduation. Around 50% of the alumni work in the US and average placement salaries for those who get job in US is USD 75,000 without bonus. She didn't give any stats about internship

The figure for 65% actually sounds plausible -- but I wouldn't be surprised if it's even lower. Likewise the initial salary of $75,000 is believable.

I don't wish to comment any more on U of M.
 
The figure for 65% actually sounds plausible -- but I wouldn't be surprised if it's even lower. Likewise the initial salary of $75,000 is believable.

I don't wish to comment any more on U of M.
How do u think this placement stat is?
 
brutal truth, both school suck in terms of education and placement, okay thats too much, but you get the idea, they are not princeton or standford fmath. so lesser of two evil, UM does have an edge in tuition department. UIUC is never known for financial programs, at least thats my opinion, it is relatively new. on the other hand, look at the student body, UIUC admitted quite a few students with sub3.2 gpa and no prior experience. Remember, your fellow students are always your foundation of professional network, and they are usually solely based on friendship. your circle of friends define who you are conscientiously and sub-conscientiously. having a competitive student body usually gives you motivation, a standard, something to look up to. those intangibles tend to be overlooked. don't simply judge a program based on review from some guy on the internet crunching numbers. its what 4 years of undergrad are for, analyze the situation with a quantitative AND a qualitative approach.

So my suggestion is, look up student body. Degree only gives you a chance for interviews, it is what you do DURING the interview that matters (technical or otherwise). guess why we aint in the mba programs =o, anyways, stat is merely a reference as any director/Md will tell you, and we quants tend to over emphasize on them. no doubt there is a correlation between placement rates and quality of the programs; however, you are not them, they might have relatives in industry that you don't and it gives them a better chance at landing the job. I hate to be cynical, but I gotta tell ya, I KNOW that a lot of the students cannot find jobs in the states, and have to go back to india and china for easy way out simply because they have relatives there. take CITIC, blackrock beijing, and new delhi for example.

I am not implying anything, but UIUC is known for its asian persuasion not only in grad but also in undergrad, helluva job in Public relation. and this brings question marks on its employment rate, something to ponder. and among those who were employed in the states, how many are working in the so-called financial industry. actuarial science is sort of gray area since you don't need a degree in mfe to pass SoA exams, and it would seem a waste to get a degree in mfe and end up getting a actsc job. I am not sure about UM numbers, but my feelings are if you smell something fishy in those numbers, the chances are, they are fishy indeed.

so anyways it ultimately comes down to curriculum, what approach are you seeking? are you a mathematics background student hoping to improve programming skills, or the other way around. Or are you pursuing PhD after graduation depending on the job economy. are their curriculums computational based or theoretically based.

Given the majority student body of indian, asian, and russian(esque), nepotism is still a predominant factor. I'm not sure about NY, but I saw/heard in Toronto, Chicago, a lot of the quant desks tend to hire specific ethnic group. i suppose it is quite hard to break the cultural barrier if they did not grow up in north america. but it is still a factor to consider, depending on where you want to work after graduation.

I hope it helps !
 
I agree with Richard in many points regarding specifically UIUC. I think that they admit far more people with less apparent quantitative skills than many other universities. I guess you can make a point that some other things also matter in the selection process, but from the outside it appears that UIUC admits many students that are far less appealing to target companies, especially here in the US and that is reflected from the placement posted above.

Though the MSFE is just a stepping stone to "get in", for the tuition they charge you should expect more from the University. I believe that other schools like UW Seattle that charge far less tuition will have similar placement statistics. Although other factors play a role into quantifying the value of an MSFE education, I believe that tuition is too high for a program of this caliber with the statistics that they have, thus makes the program less competitive.
 
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