Columbia MAFN Why Columbia MAFN never share placement stats

[anonymecon]

I am puzzled about the job placement in MAFN.
MAFN do not disclose internship/full-time placement rates or percentages that international students find jobs in the U.S..
I once mailed the coordinator and the reply was they just do not have those statistical information.

So what is the real placement situation of this program? And why don't they gather and distribute the statistics to attract more competitive students?
Anyone could share opinions?

 

[Reyn S]

I have the same problem here. Actually there is a handbook of students profile in that program each year, maybe you could refer to that.

 

[pingu]

And why don't they gather and distribute the statistics to attract more competitive students?
Anyone could share opinions?

Why should they do it? I'm surprised these universities publish numbers at all. Look at this forum through the years. Columbia have a platoon of people ready to give them their money just to have the Columbia name on a paper. That's a premium over other schools. I wouldn't bother publishing any number at all.

If there is any indication of the posts around Quantnet, there are going to be way more applicants to this program than seats every year.

 

[IntoDarkness]

give me Columbia name on my resume! I have money!!!

 

[CasanovaJ]

They don't need to... they got 1000+ applications last year for 100 spots.

 

[Zhenghao Li]

They're not under the business school so they don't have the resources to actually do that.

 

[CasanovaJ]

They're not under the business school so they don't have the resources to actually do that.

That's a very convenient argument for them to be able to be make... but I don't know that it's actually true (and I happen to doubt it).

 

[Zhenghao Li]

That's a very convenient argument for them to be able to be make... but I don't know that it's actually true (and I happen to doubt it).

Yes it is. But we should understand that Business school usually need to collect employment reports for their MBA students anyway so it costs significantly less to collect further information from MFE students. For engineering or Math students, however, they need to set up a new system to collect the information if they want and clearly they won't have the funding like business schools.

 

[implol]

Yes it is. But we should understand that Business school usually need to collect employment reports for their MBA students anyway so it costs significantly less to collect further information from MFE students. For engineering or Math students, however, they need to set up a new system to collect the information if they want and clearly they won't have the funding like business schools.

what? WHAT? MFE is under engineering school......
i dont think it has anything to do with the resources... it is just that business schools put more efforts to collect while other schools may just ask for voluntary reports.

 

[CasanovaJ]

Yes it is. But we should understand that Business school usually need to collect employment reports for their MBA students anyway so it costs significantly less to collect further information from MFE students. For engineering or Math students, however, they need to set up a new system to collect the information if they want and clearly they won't have the funding like business schools.

If you're about to start an MFE program and that's how you're rationalizing an $80k investment with no placement statistics, I may have a bridge to sell you.

 

[Zhenghao Li]

If you're about to start an MFE program and that's how you're rationalizing an $80k investment with no placement statistics, I may have a bridge to sell you.

Haha, luckily I'm going to an MFE program with really detailed employment report. I understand what you're saying though. It's really disturbing that many programs don't have published placement statistics.

 

[bigbadwolf]

It's really disturbing that many programs don't have published placement statistics.

Their MFE rackets would implode if they did. They choose, rather, to maintain a dignified silence.

 

[anonymecon]

Their MFE rackets would implode if they did. They choose, rather, to maintain a dignified silence.

But some less-renowned programs, like those at GaTech, BU, UChicago, etc do disclose their placement stats and their stats look great. For example, GaTech has an extremely high percentage of placement in U.S.. So does this mean these programs are actually better than mafn at Columbia?

 

[bigbadwolf]

But some less-renowned programs, like those at GaTech, BU, UChicago, etc do disclose their placement stats and their stats look great. For example, GaTech has an extremely high percentage of placement in U.S.. So does this mean these programs are actually better than mafn at Columbia?

Is it a detailed breakdown so that you know starting salaries and which banks/companies hired them? And to be candid, I wouldn't be surprised if some of these programs you mention weren't better in terms of job placement than Columbia's MAFN. See, the only logical reason to not disclose placement stats is if they're not sterling, nothing to write home about. Schools with good placement rates flaunt them; they're not bashful about them.

 

[chelsea j]

I have two ideas:

1. They are not attractive. Notice in a review of the MAFN program form 9/13 the reviewer mentions "placement stats are being collected." Well about 1.5 years has passed since that review, why am I not seeing stats?

2. They don't care to. Maybe the name brand is enough to attract enough of an applicant pool that they're satisfied with the quality of their students each year. I think they get a lot of part-timers who are already working in NYC, maybe that's their angle?

The idea that the cost of doing so is prohibitive is... absurd. However, I can't help but wonder, if their placements are really that bad then how are they consistently ranked higher on quantnet than schools who disclose great placement stats (like UCLA)??

 

[implol]

well, i think many students in MAFN cannot find jobs in US so they go back to their home country. then the brand name is important. the quality of students at Columbia is more likely better than the students at these less-known programs.

also, keep in mind that placement stats can be manipulated. for example, goldman sachs may hire GaTech grads to do software instead of quant if they studied cs undergrad.

to really know what is going on, you need to ask many current students in the program. it is the best way to access placement stats. i would not trust any published stats completely.

 

[Reyn S]

The director said he tried to collect the placement stats for the summer internship last year, but not many students gave a sh*t on him, and he could do nothing to force them to do so.

I can tell you the summer internship stats in this year. I guess 50-65 students are looking for summer internship, and I only know about 35 of them. So please do a little bit bootstrapping by yourself. All of the students I'm talking about are not USA citizens.

Company Position Location
Goldman Sachs Strats HK
Credit Suisse IBD HK
Credit Suisse Technology NYC
HSBC S & T HK
AIG Actuarial LA
AIG Quant Research NYC
Societe Generale Technology NYC
Citi Quant Research NYC
Trexquant Summer Intern NYC
Trexquant Summer Intern NYC
Moody's Financial Modeling NYC
Barclay's Market Risk NYC
Bank of New York Mellon Corporate Treasury NYC
Black Rock Summer Intern SF
Bank of America Summer Intern NYC

When I wrote "Summer Intern", it means I don't know the position's name. I also knew 4 other people found summer internship, but I don't know which companies. A lot of others are still waiting for the result after the final round interview. Actually I just got an offer yesterday, and another offer today.

I hope this will help you.

Soactually here mean the statistics regarding internship is okay in this program even for those non US guys, right? Not so bad like the reviews in this forum?

 

[Reyn S]

Yes i think the reason might be from last year, the admission committee focused much more on the GRE Verbal Score and TOEFL Score, which makes the students in this year have much better English communication skills than before. It seems that they continued to do so this year, and basically all the Chinese students I know who are coming in this program for 2015 fall have 330+ GRE and 107+ TOEFL.
They used to focus more on the students' math background, but ONLY being good at math is definitely not enough to find a job in Wall Street.

Yes，definitely u r right, communication would be even more important in the job interview. I also got a 331 gre, but still waiting for its result of this program, no idea.

 

[Reyn S]

I guess you should try email Laurent for an early decision. It's already in the middle of April, and don't let them feel that you're no longer interested in the program.

Really nice idea. May I follow you?

 

[CasanovaJ]

I'd be careful about asking for an early decision unless you absolutely have to. From MAFN website--

Requesting an Early Final Decision
If you have been offered admission to another program and need to give them an answer, then you can request an early final decision by contacting the MAFN Office.

You will need provide us with:

1. The name of the school that is needing a decision;
2. The date that the other school needs a decision;

We may or may not agree to make an expedited final decision, but if we do, then we need to hold your application to a particularly high standard, because we cannot compare it to other applications that we receive at a later date.