I'm a Chicago recruiter with 25 years experience specializing in quantitative, systematic and electronic trading. AMA

[Todd Fahey]

I am a capital markets recruiter who has been in this role for 25 years. I specialize in quantitative, systematic and electronic trading professionals across both sell-side and buy-side firms in quantitative research/trading, algorithmic trading, systematic trading, quantitative development, and quantitative risk roles globally. I have worked with many of the top banks, hedge funds, proprietary trading firms, and asset managers in helping them source their human capital needs.

I recruit for positions in NYC, London, and Chicago.

I did an AMA here in 2007 and contributed a featured article in the QuantNet 2012-2013 International Guide to Financial Engineering Programs.

As many members back then are now practitioners in senior quant positions and there is growing interest among QuantNet members to learn about the quant job market, Andy reached out to invite me to do an AMA.

So Ask Me Anything.

 

[Stochastics]

If someone wants to gain a top level expertise to be in a position of building advanced mathematical models. So for this do you think FE programs from any of the universities are really enough? Are these courses complete and rigorous enough to match with the Ph.D level expertise? If not, then do you say that in general Ph.Ds have an advantage over students with just Masters. Also according to you is going for a Ph.D a right choice if someone wants to be amongst top quants of Wall Street? I understand getting a Ph.D is no guarantee of success, hence my focus is to learn about the rigors of the program(Ph,.D vs 12-15 months of Masters)

 

[Todd Fahey]

If someone wants to gain a top level expertise to be in a position of building advanced mathematical models. So for this do you think FE programs from any of the universities are really enough? Are these courses complete and rigorous enough to match with the Ph.D level expertise? If not, then do you say that in general Ph.Ds have an advantage over students with just Masters. Also according to you is going for a Ph.D a right choice if someone wants to be amongst top quants of Wall Street? I understand getting a Ph.D is no guarantee of success, hence my focus is to learn about the rigors of the program(Ph,.D vs 12-15 months of Masters)

I would submit to the premise that if you want to be in a position of building advanced mathematical models as your career goal, pursue a PhD and a professorship/tenure track. I believe in the idea that there is theoretical and practical applications for the pursuit of mathematical models. If theory and elegance are your passion, go the PhD route. If direct applicability and tangible results, I would recommend the FE programs: they're shorter, faster, and more cost effective. Being 'amongst the top quants' of Wall Street... what exactly does that mean? There's no honest way to quantify this, so I will speak to it as I would to anyone in or out of this industry: be the best 'you' that you can be, continue to learn and grow, and that will be enough - no matter what.

 

[Felixfelixfelix]

Hi Todd, thank you for sharing your knowledge!

Here are my questions:

When recruiting a junior candidate for a quantitative research position, what factors do you consider important that candidates often overlook?

Quants often have weaker soft skills compared to their CFA/MSc Finance counterparts. Therefore, how can they distinguish themselves and advance to management roles?

At the entry level, what are some of the typical challenges that quant careers present, and how can they be avoided?

 

[Todd Fahey]

Hi Todd, thank you for sharing your knowledge!

Here are my questions:

When recruiting a junior candidate for a quantitative research position, what factors do you consider important that candidates often overlook?

Quants often have weaker soft skills compared to their CFA/MSc Finance counterparts. Therefore, how can they distinguish themselves and advance to management roles?

At the entry level, what are some of the typical challenges that quant careers present, and how can they be avoided?

Hi Felix.

Alas, I haven't been involved with junior level hiring in a long number of years. That said, the same 'rules' apply to all - and not just during interviews. First, communication skills are of the utmost importance. You could be the most brilliant person in your field. If you can't communicate with your colleagues, peers, bosses, etc., your brilliance won't matter (typically). If communication is a difficulty, consider joining your local chapter of Toastmasters - it will help. Second, be nice. Honey attracts more than vinegar. Finally, be a team player. Add value in all that you do. Take on the extra and the difficult tasks. It helps set you apart from the rest.

 

[Christian]

In what ways has the introduction of new technology influenced the candidate profile at the firms you work with over the years? Since your last AMA in 2007 A LOT has changed on the data and infrastructure side - cloud computing, big data tools, blockchain, etc. Do see an increased demand for highly technical leaders who aren't developing the models but actually making sure the best, most efficient solution is delivered to implement the model within the larger process?

 

[Tigga]

Thanks Todd for your second AMA. Appreciate your time.
Can you give some color on the quant job market differences between NYC, London, and Chicago. We have plenty of people here working in all those places as well as plenty of people trying to make a decision on where to get their quant degree.
It would be really helpful to hear your take on the kind of roles and firms each location has an advantage over others.

 

[Todd Fahey]

In what ways has the introduction of new technology influenced the candidate profile at the firms you work with over the years? Since your last AMA in 2007 A LOT has changed on the data and infrastructure side - cloud computing, big data tools, blockchain, etc. Do see an increased demand for highly technical leaders who aren't developing the models but actually making sure the best, most efficient solution is delivered to implement the model within the larger process?

Hi Christian.

I can't say that the introduction of new technology has at all influenced the candidate profiles. The reason for that is due to the fact that every client we work with in the quantitative finance community has an exponentially high bar. When I first started recruiting, COBOL, AS 400's, and Tcl/tk were all still part of the experience requirements. The point is technology continues to evolve and improve - the bar remains at the same height. As such, the toolkits have all improved, and with those improvements, the required capabilities and knowledge of the leaders has needed to evolve with it. That said, the experience, the leadership, and the technology don't always move in lockstep with each other. To generically answer your last question: yes - but it is nuanced more than you might expect.

 

[Todd Fahey]

Thanks Todd for your second AMA. Appreciate your time.
Can you give some color on the quant job market differences between NYC, London, and Chicago. We have plenty of people here working in all those places as well as plenty of people trying to make a decision on where to get their quant degree.
It would be really helpful to hear your take on the kind of roles and firms each location has an advantage over others.

Hi Tigga.

This question is actually fairly difficult to answer. The one thing I can scratch off the surface is that 'where' you pursue your degree program doesn't necessarily need to correlate directly with which market you want to target (unless visa issues are a concern). If I were to rank locations based only on quant related opportunities, NYC metro area would be #1, London #2, and Chicago #3 - and those rankings are determined by the number and breadth of opportunities. NYC has banks, prop, hedge funds, asset managers and sophisticated family offices - the same as London and Chicago. But NYC has the biggest number of all of these in terms of sheer size. Depending upon the firm and it's size will give you some indication as to its focus points and potential advantages over others. But your question is a little bit too broad to get much more narrow than what I pointed out.

 

[Tigga]

Thank you for your answer Todd.
Are you seeing more entrances to the quant industry by people with the new type of master degrees such as Big Data/Data Science/Machine Learning/etc.
Are these graduates getting jobs that traditionally served by MFE programs?

 

[Michelle]

Todd, welcome back.
Can you talk a bit about the importance of programming skills these days?
Is the quant finance field still dominantly C++ and Python? What other technical skills or programming stack that you see in high demand these days?

 

[Todd Fahey]

Thank you for your answer Todd.
Are you seeing more entrances to the quant industry by people with the new type of master degrees such as Big Data/Data Science/Machine Learning/etc.
Are these graduates getting jobs that traditionally served by MFE programs?

I haven't noticed them - yet. Again, I recruit at the more seasoned end of the spectrum and these are, for lack of a better word, 'designer' degrees that are hitting on the current push in the domains. I have no knowledge of these degree programs, so I am NOT disparaging them - they just seem flavored towards the trends at the moment. I would imaging there is not a huge differential of concentrations that you wouldn't get from the classical degree programs (only course weightings that allow for being distinguished from another track). Relative to my comments, I can't give any indication at all about the idea that they are pushing into the MFE space. The generic degree titles cover areas a lot wider than just financial firms, which is what the MFE programs target.

 

[Todd Fahey]

Todd, welcome back.
Can you talk a bit about the importance of programming skills these days?
Is the quant finance field still dominantly C++ and Python? What other technical skills or programming stack that you see in high demand these days?

Thanks.

Programming remains - and will likely remain for a long time to come (depending upon AI capabilities) - a firm requirement in the financial domain. And the requirement to remain hand's-on throughout the majority of your career until/if one ends up in a purely strategic/managerial role is pretty much a necessity today. C++, python and java remain the primary languages, but there's always someone who wants to be different (OCaml, scala, F#, etc.). If you stick with the former, you're well positioned for anyone who might want to go tangential.

 

[NeuroQuant]

Hi Todd, what advice would you give someone to build a strong application for a junior quant trader or quant trader analyst role?

 

[matthewzz]

Hi Todd,
I noticed you listed NYC as top overall, would you say this still holds for derivates products, or would Chicago be the top place for derivatives trading

What advice would you give someone looking to get into a QT role straight from an undergraduate, specifically on the west coast?

I'm doing one extra quarter at my university (grad Dec 2023), but it feels like breaking in will be almost impossible being west-coast and a low gpa. Does it make more sense to try to do any MFE program to break into quant trading...? Info: ucla, math and econ b.s. with cs minor (took one of my uni's MFE stoch calc class if thats useful?), 3.5 gpa, risk analyst and swe internship at some decently well-known companies, done two projects: one was a stock/option back tester with UI similar to robinhood, and other is going to be reinforced learning tradingbot... would prefer not to sink money into an east coast MFE but bottom-line is I want to become a QT.

Thanks for the AMA, cheers!

 

[wanderful]

Hi Todd,
Helping my brother to ask an offer choice question (Since he doesn't use the platform.)

He previously worked at a smaller quant fund for 4 years and was quite successful with 2 to 3 mature quant strategies produced by him. But that fund does not have good compensation, so he decided to interview for larger fund. He recently got an offer from a multimanager platform as a quant PM.(Think of Millenium or Balyasny,) Another offer is a senior quant position from a quant firm (Think of Citadel Securities or DE Shaw).

Both offers have roughly the same package. But each has pros and cons:

1. The PM offer can initially offer him 1 Headcount, and if he is successful, headcounts can expand to around 7-8. In that way, he has a group of quants working for him and certainly has a faster cycle for producing new strategies. However, if he cannot produce solid PnL within one year or two, then potentially he will be fired. And past good performance does not necessarily indicate the future, so there is such a possibility that strategies are not working for the one year period. There is much pressure but also large upside.
2. The Senior QR offer can allow him to participate in quite different projects, and may have wider asset class exposure. He can also collaborate with much more senior quants to hone up the skillsets. If he generate PnL, he will also be compensated accordingly. And even if no PnL in first or second year, likely he will not be fired easily. However, there is no such a concept of having a group working for him in such a scenario. So even if he did well, he will be working on his own and producing strategies on his own. The cycle of producing strategies can be slower.

He is still hesitating. Given such scenario, what will you choose and why? And which can open up more door for him if he decided to move few years later from your point of view? Much appreciated!