Engineers break into Investment Banking (IB)

[Jayanthan]

i see from your profile that you are an aerospace engineer, did you happen to take any finance courses during your undergrad ?

Nope. I took couple of economics classes though.

 

[Ken Abbott]

The biggest challenge you may have is proving that you have a genuine interest in finance.

 

[Jayanthan]

The biggest challenge you may have is proving that you have a genuine interest in finance.

Thank you ken, Any suggestion?

 

[Ken Abbott]

Do you follow the markets? Do you read the financial press? Do the workings of the macroeconomy fascinate you? If the answer to these three aren't a resounding "yes", proceed with extreme care?

When you interview, be able to prove that you've done your homework. Know who any company's competitors are and how they make money. Understand the regulatory framework. Be familiar with the company's structure and history.

 

[kamikade]

I think what Ken mentioned are what you have during the second round interview. You may be asked a lot of technical and fit questions during the first round/phone interview. You should be familiar with accounting concepts, at least at an intro to financial accounting course, and finance, you should know well corporate finance concepts, different types of valuation and financial modelling. You should know well all of those things and answer them logically too.

 

[JLS]

Yes, it's definitely possible and much easier if you have a connection, or someone on the inside (preferably someone the firm likes) who can recommend you a recruit. I'm an engineer and I'm speaking from experience. The best thing for you to do is shoot for a a summer IB analyst internship (direct line to full time), but it will be tough to convince them of why you want to switch to finance. Your aptitude and quantitative skills may look favorable, but you'll be considered a "risky" investment to the firm regardless. They'll ask: Does this person really know what they want career-wise? If we offer them full time, will they be in it for a year then leave if they don't like it?

So what's you reason for the switch?? And what's your story/sales pitch?? I'm just curious ... good luck!

 

[JLS]

The biggest challenge you may have is proving that you have a genuine interest in finance.

very true ... # 1 issue when you go from engineering to finance ... you'll need to very convincing ... lol

 

[robopool]

How about you go for the firms that are well-known for hiring "only scientists", and not so much the smooth-talking finance guys. I read an article about Renaissance (one of the top hedge funds of the world) that they are not hiring from Wall Street AT ALL, and they only hire scientists (ie. people with B.Sc or M.Sc or PhD in a scientific field). On their website it is pretty clearly stated too. You could target firms like this, and it might be easier for you to get your foot in.

 

[JLS]

Or he could work his way up from back office to middle office then to front office finance ... that's a good way too. Back/middle office positions are generally filled with people of different backgrounds.

 

[Ken Abbott]

Or he could work his way up from back office to middle office then to front office finance ...]

This is becoming more and more difficult. You shouldn't anticipate that kind of career path post-UBS.

 

[passyingby]

This is becoming more and more difficult. You shouldn't anticipate that kind of career path post-UBS.

I'm a bit naive here - what happened at UBS?

 

[darth]

Kweku Adoboli incident... Trader who lost $2 billion ..

 

[KaiRu]

I'm a bit naive here - what happened at UBS?

If you move from middle office to front office in the same company - you usually have enough knowledge of supporting systems to hide all your illegal activity. Moreover, one usually have enough rights to do this because they are not revoked - IT security for front office is a mess, IT security for middle office is even bigger mess.

 

[purplyboy]

Actually, there's a rule now that people in certain positions automatically have to take something like 2 weeks off at 1 time in a year or something like that. I'm not sure what the exact rule is. It's to prevent that person from hiding trades and paperwork.

 

[Ken Abbott]

Most people with access to books and records are, by policy, required to take two weeks off with limited access to systems. Many instances of fraud have been detected during these vacation periods.

 

[MiloRambaldi]

Actually, there's a rule now that people in certain positions automatically have to take something like 2 weeks off at 1 time in a year or something like that. I'm not sure what the exact rule is. It's to prevent that person from hiding trades and paperwork.

Here's the policy for our department in case you are interested:

Enterprise-wide Mandatory Absence Policy

This policy requires all employees to take a minimum of five consecutive business days absence from their regular job responsibilities during each full calendar year of employment. Jurisdictions whose mandatory absence guidelines require a greater number of sequential days off must continue to follow those stipulations. Mandatory absence covers any time away from regular job responsibilities and includes vacation days, leaves of absence, jury duty, etc.

During any period of mandatory absence, employees cannot have direct or indirect access to any trading, risk management, accounting or clearing system that may affect transactions or record information on **********'s books and records. However, employees may continue to have access to systems that do not affect **********’s books and records such as Outlook, Excel and Word.

 

[alain]

Actually, there's a rule now that people in certain positions automatically have to take something like 2 weeks off at 1 time in a year or something like that. I'm not sure what the exact rule is. It's to prevent that person from hiding trades and paperwork.

This rules has existed in everyplace I have worked since 1998.

 

[passyingby]

Kweku Adoboli incident... Trader who lost $2 billion ..

Man, these delta-one desks seem to be a hotbed for fraud (which is ironic given that it's supposed to be the least risky)! First you have Leeson, then Kerviel, and now this guy. I don't see what the exact "ah-ha" moment was that caused banks to restrict back->front office promotions though. UBS's incident doesn't seem unique. Is there actually a new rule out or w/e that restricts internal mobility? Or is it just a big cultural change?

 

[onthesc]

2 internships in the industry? As in, in tech right? If you are set on banking, I would suggest applying for some kind of Masters degree at a target to greatly improve your chances. Of course, that should be your fall back. Networking is really your main way of getting in at this point, especially you've already graduated.

I would focus on MM and boutique firms since it is way past the formal recruitment schedule. It is definitely doable to break in with an engineering degree, sometimes it even gives you an advantage (more interesting story, good analytical skills, TMT/Industrial group likes you, etc)

 

[Jayanthan]

thank you onthesc