Masters programs in Hong Kong

[Jeffrey K.W. Lo]

Hi all, although there are numerous information with regards to Masters programs in US/UK on this forum, I find relative few info about the Masters programs in Hong Kong, such as

1. University of Hong Kong,
MFin (but offers MFE or Risk Management stream)
http://www.sef.hku.hk/postgradprog/master_finance/index.php

2. Hong Kong University Science & Technology,
MAFM, (Masters of Science in Financial Mathematics)
http://www.math.ust.hk/pg/programs/mafs/


My question is, relatively to the MFE programs on the ranking list, how good/bad are these masters programs in terms of reputation (globally or locally), network, and actual content? Would they even be within top 50 of the list?

Also, are there other good programs of similar type (exclude MBAs) around Hong Kong/ Asia?

Thank you very much in advance.

Jeffrey

 

[Andy Nguyen]

These are regional programs competing with Singapore-based programs for Asian applicants who prefer to stay local.
If the tuition difference is negligible and one's profile is competitive enough for programs in the US, why would one not want to go oversea?
It's really hard to compare HK programs to those in the west because they not competing directly for the same pool of applicants and jobs.

 

[bullion]

Honestly, no one has heard of the programs from this site outside of the country either. Most recruiters recognize the school names, and most students end up in American / European banks through school placement. I haven't seen a single Chinese bank on the CMU recruitment partner list, and most Princeton / Columbia / Cornell / MIT recruits can probably care less which programs the students are from. I think I saw from an old post saying that at one point the Baruch director explicitly questioned an applicant's post graduation plan abroad because Baruch really doesn't have much oversea name brand value even though it is regarded as a top notch competitor in New York. My point is that there's an inequality when it comes to schools. US companies have much greater global footprint, so they can recruit in the States from US schools and send them to China. Chinese banks, however, have far fewer global operations and tend to stay local. Things simply have nothing to do with a program's quality.

In any case, I'm a big proponent of staying local unless necessary. Besides potentially lower costs, you will have a much bigger alumni community to draw support from if you plan on staying in HK. While it's true that Chinese students who've gotten graduate degrees in the States might be looked favorably to a certain degree, you staying local allows you much information advantage and flexibility. You can get an internship while still in school, you can attend lectures at HKSI, and you can network at local CFA chapters if you're a student. As long as the banks recruit at HKU and HKUST (and I know they do), everything else is pretty much the same once you got the job.

 

[Jeffrey K.W. Lo]

Thanks Andy and Bullion for your replies.

Andy, actually the tuition differences is huge. The two programs I listed cost 200k HKD and 120k HKD, respectively, which is significantly lower than the programs in the west. This is also a reason why I'm skeptical about the quality and reputation of these local programs. I agree with you that we can't compare the two in terms of jobs and career prospects, but do you know anything how about the quality of the programs in terms of the content being taught?

Bullion, people here in HK are also aiming to join the western banks, there aren't really any good "Chinese banks" to work at here (I might be wrong about this). There are some really rich Chinese hedge funds, but to my knowledge most of them are just Long Short equities with relatively simple models, and the culture is also quite different. I agree with you on the fact that local programs can yield me better networking for local jobs. But seems like the senior management of the big banks are also people that came from overseas, so overseas graduated are probably preferred over local. Maybe I am overrating the international ibanks, but my experience with some local (prop trading) firms were horrible.

Jeffrey

 

[bullion]

believez
Chinese banks are arguably a lot stronger because many of them are semi-government entities. But the pay tend to be lower and work hours longer due to cultural perception on the value of service which bankers provide. With that said, Western banks had begun facing intense competition at least on local deals in the region, and CICC also has an office in NYC I believe.

In the West, investment management has fallen to most managers taking comfort in managing index funds and laying the burden of investment decisions on the individual investors. In China, however, people are really critical about even the mutual fund when they lose money (even for index funds). For those very rich hedge fund you speak of, many managers have government backings and basically acts as white gloves for local monopolies. In recent years, many government officials have successfully packaged their children to oversea elite schools (and some asset transfer), so it is now very common to have fund manager who might be only 2-3 years experience out of MBA programs from MIT, Harvard, Stanford, etc. The models are certainly simple, but it's far from fair competitions. In fact, many Western banks now must invest in local Chinese PE shops to gain access to these monopolistic investments. So if you're not someone's niece's classmate's brother's neighbor, it's unlikely you can "succeed" there.

Western banks have more global footprint than Chinese banks do. Chinese branches are just subsidiaries and they often get "appointments" from headquarters in the US, which recruits heavily from US business schools. These banks have feeder relations with all the major schools, and those schools supply ample Chinese speaking graduates for the banks to expatriate back to Asia. MBA admissions often act as a "filter" for banking recruitment, and the argument is that if you were any good you would've come to the US for business school and subsequently get recruited from the headquarter in the US. I will expect the story to be quite similar for European or Singaporean banks as well.

Given how investment banking deal value has declined 10% in Asian Pacific region last year, the competition in Asia will certainly intensify. So unless you can get into one of the top 7 business schools, there's really no point coming to the US if you intend to go back.