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It feels like Baruch is getting overvalued, however I will apply for Baruch also since its in NY city which will have some benefits in getting internship in NY.
Where would you rank Baruch MFE with top programs ?
- Thread starter Michelle
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I saw your exact comment over at GD and the responses there. I would be interested in your value evaluation equation.
Good luck with your Baruch application. You should hedge it with other undervalued options in NYC.
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My MFE tuition at Baruch as an NYC (or NY State) resident will be around $10K. All Manhattan alternatives are $40K and up, including the most expensive which is not even taught live in the city! Now explain to me again the relative values.
The best alternative I found for value was the Wilmott CQF, and my brain (or marriage, or both) would have exploded trying to do that course in 6 months.
Value
Buddy, why would you apply for Baruch MFE if you think the program is over valued?
Shouldn't you spend your dollar wisely in another program?
I have done a survey in terms of cost of study. I think Baruch is a good buy. If BMW costs 40K in UK, 35K in Australia, or 50k++ at CMU..the likes, you pay less than 20K to buy the same product. I will go for it.
Good luck.
Buddy, why would you apply for Baruch MFE if you think the program is over valued?
Shouldn't you spend your dollar wisely in another program?
I have done a survey in terms of cost of study. I think Baruch is a good buy. If BMW costs 40K in UK, 35K in Australia, or 50k++ at CMU..the likes, you pay less than 20K to buy the same product. I will go for it.
Good luck.
A few years ago, outcome could be very different depending on where you go.
By outcome I mean job placement and the quality of knowledge.
A few years ago, these two were different for different schools. But now, many schools catch up in terms of what they offer, key subjects -- stochastic calculus, derivative pricing, programming, portfolio management, risk management -- are taught almost everywhere. And companies are, obviously, widen their search for new people.
By outcome I mean job placement and the quality of knowledge.
A few years ago, these two were different for different schools. But now, many schools catch up in terms of what they offer, key subjects -- stochastic calculus, derivative pricing, programming, portfolio management, risk management -- are taught almost everywhere. And companies are, obviously, widen their search for new people.
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Kool that is true; but 'me' just being curios -
I know this from the forum -
1. The students who get into Baruch are having good profiles and GRE scores.
2. The fees is less.
BUT
I have never heard of the packages they come out with. And also the positions they launch themselves into!
Help me understand.
Kapil
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Baruch posts package info for recent graduating classes at
http://www.baruch.cuny.edu/math/masters_employment_stats_new.html
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When I said that Baruch´s MFE-program overvalued I was thinking of the admission-rate of 14% for 2007, not the tuition-fee. Im sure its an excellent education but its no Ive League school.
Why don´t Baruch increase the classroom-size? There is obviously a huge demand for this MFE-program so Baruch could easily double the class-size with just a slight decrease in the minimum GRE of admitted students. This would be a win-win situation for the school and for the applicants.
Why don´t Baruch increase the classroom-size? There is obviously a huge demand for this MFE-program so Baruch could easily double the class-size with just a slight decrease in the minimum GRE of admitted students. This would be a win-win situation for the school and for the applicants.
I am sure there is a reason for this. I am also sure the Program Director Dan Stefanica has planned everything for many years ahead. And if increasing class size is in his plans, the program will grow in size on the day he planned
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Hi,
I think Ivy League schools became Ivy League school because they provided excellent education first. So as long as the MFE program provides constantly high quality education and ouputs highly qualified students to the industry, it will establish its reputation eventually. Many of students in this program are working for bulge bracket now. Their choice of going to Baruch is also a recognition of the quality of this program.
About the classroom-size, we state clearly that we dont control the size of the class. The admission of each student is based on his/her ability to survive in this program and find a good job. The classroom-size is increasing each year but the applicants increase even more.
dstefan
Baruch MFE Director
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That is correct.
dstefan
Baruch MFE Director
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If this is the case, it was wrong to use the word ``overvalued".
Your post leaves the (I hope erroneous) impression that you want the Baruch MFE program to increase the size of its class so you have a better chance of being admitted. As a prospective student, I would want to study in a strong program, not necessarily in a large program.
Sam Harris
Space Systems Engineer
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Seeing that I am not a student at Baruch, and since I have been to both first tier and second tier schools, I have an opinion about the subject.
After High School, I went to the US Naval Academy (aka Annapolis) which is the MOST SELECTIVE SCHOOL ON EARTH. Out of 65,000 applicants annually, 1,500 are accepted and 1,250 attend. More Naval Academy Graduates are Senators, Congressmen, Astronauts, and CEOs of Fourtune 500 Companies than any other school.
I didn't graduate, but not because I was failing out. I chose to change careers from the Navy to the Air Force, and the only way to do that was to leave and finish school elsewhere. The education is completely free, and so long as you leave before the first day of your Junior year, there is no obligation to pay it back.
I left on the first day of my Junior year and went to Clemson University, a decent but not spectacular engineering school in South Carolina. What were the differences?
(1) At Annapolis, ever single professor I had was famous. Most had written two dozen books or more, and they were all pioneers in their career field. At Clemson, the professors were smart, but not particularly famous. Only one professor in the entire department was widely published.
(2) At Annapolis, the teacher to student ratio was amazing. Freshman year, we had about 20-25 students per professor with each professor limited to three sections. Sophomore year, that number dropped to 8-15 per professor. Again, professors were limited to 3 sections, so they only taught 24 - 75 students per semester. At Clemson, the teacher to student ratio was about 50:1 and one of my professors taught 6 classes!
(3) At Annapolis, the students were from the best families you could imagine. Senators, Congressmen, Admirals, Generals, Billionaires, Ambassadors, etc. These were my friends and my colleagues. At Clemson, the students were average Joe's, sons of engineers, plumbers, local businessmen, etc.
(4) At Annapolis, the facilities were first rate. In my field of study: electrical engineering, we had the best lab equipment, the best of everything. At Clemson, the facilities were acceptable. Do you really need a 40GHz Oscilloscope for undergraduate EE lab? We had to fish through boxes of resistors and capacitors rather than having freshly minted ones available for each assignment.
(5) At Annapolis, the support was phenomenal. We had counselors, tutors, etc. Also, you could call a professor on Sun afternoon and they would meet you in the library to (one on one) go over homework! At Clemson, the support was nonexistent. You took care of yourself. You learned for yourself.
(6) At Annapolis, everything was paid for. At Clemson, nothing was paid for. I actually worked two jobs to pay my way through school, as a car salesman and a waiter.
In the end, my GPA actually went DOWN going to Clemson from what it had been. Clemson was definitely harder. The curriculum was identical (there are after all ABET accreditations). I had more fun at Clemson because I took my time and graduated in 5 yrs instead of 4. Plus I was part of a sports car club which the Naval Academy didn't have. I also learned a bit of humility because I didn't have famous graduates coming around every week and giving lectures on why we were the masters of the universe. If I had graduated from Annapolis, I'm almost certain I would be an intolerably arrogant prick.
So, the differences are real, but they DO NOT lie within the curriculum. There is an image, and the image is real, but it has little to do with the school itself and more to do with the people who go there. I figured it out one day that the Naval Academy doesn't make the leaders of tomorrow, it finds the leaders of tomorrow. There is a big difference.
I have a friend who graduated from Clemson who owns a billion dollar engineering firm, Kahn Industries. I have another friend who graduated from Clemson who was in the top 5 Mortgage Brokers (by total $$$ financed) in the nation for Bank of America working out of Anderson, SC... averaging $83k a loan! He closed more than $20mil in loans in one year... and he did better than $10mil for 5yrs straight.
In conclusion, it is my opinion that you do not lose one iota of academic preparation going to Baruch or UNC Charlotte for your MFE. What you loose is the brand name, so you may not get that hedge fund or snotty IB straight out of school. However, if you are intelligent, hard working, and most importantly, enthusiastic, it is my sincere belief that you will equal or surpass those who expect life to give them something just because they graduated from XXXXXXX.
After High School, I went to the US Naval Academy (aka Annapolis) which is the MOST SELECTIVE SCHOOL ON EARTH. Out of 65,000 applicants annually, 1,500 are accepted and 1,250 attend. More Naval Academy Graduates are Senators, Congressmen, Astronauts, and CEOs of Fourtune 500 Companies than any other school.
I didn't graduate, but not because I was failing out. I chose to change careers from the Navy to the Air Force, and the only way to do that was to leave and finish school elsewhere. The education is completely free, and so long as you leave before the first day of your Junior year, there is no obligation to pay it back.
I left on the first day of my Junior year and went to Clemson University, a decent but not spectacular engineering school in South Carolina. What were the differences?
(1) At Annapolis, ever single professor I had was famous. Most had written two dozen books or more, and they were all pioneers in their career field. At Clemson, the professors were smart, but not particularly famous. Only one professor in the entire department was widely published.
(2) At Annapolis, the teacher to student ratio was amazing. Freshman year, we had about 20-25 students per professor with each professor limited to three sections. Sophomore year, that number dropped to 8-15 per professor. Again, professors were limited to 3 sections, so they only taught 24 - 75 students per semester. At Clemson, the teacher to student ratio was about 50:1 and one of my professors taught 6 classes!
(3) At Annapolis, the students were from the best families you could imagine. Senators, Congressmen, Admirals, Generals, Billionaires, Ambassadors, etc. These were my friends and my colleagues. At Clemson, the students were average Joe's, sons of engineers, plumbers, local businessmen, etc.
(4) At Annapolis, the facilities were first rate. In my field of study: electrical engineering, we had the best lab equipment, the best of everything. At Clemson, the facilities were acceptable. Do you really need a 40GHz Oscilloscope for undergraduate EE lab? We had to fish through boxes of resistors and capacitors rather than having freshly minted ones available for each assignment.
(5) At Annapolis, the support was phenomenal. We had counselors, tutors, etc. Also, you could call a professor on Sun afternoon and they would meet you in the library to (one on one) go over homework! At Clemson, the support was nonexistent. You took care of yourself. You learned for yourself.
(6) At Annapolis, everything was paid for. At Clemson, nothing was paid for. I actually worked two jobs to pay my way through school, as a car salesman and a waiter.
In the end, my GPA actually went DOWN going to Clemson from what it had been. Clemson was definitely harder. The curriculum was identical (there are after all ABET accreditations). I had more fun at Clemson because I took my time and graduated in 5 yrs instead of 4. Plus I was part of a sports car club which the Naval Academy didn't have. I also learned a bit of humility because I didn't have famous graduates coming around every week and giving lectures on why we were the masters of the universe. If I had graduated from Annapolis, I'm almost certain I would be an intolerably arrogant prick.
So, the differences are real, but they DO NOT lie within the curriculum. There is an image, and the image is real, but it has little to do with the school itself and more to do with the people who go there. I figured it out one day that the Naval Academy doesn't make the leaders of tomorrow, it finds the leaders of tomorrow. There is a big difference.
I have a friend who graduated from Clemson who owns a billion dollar engineering firm, Kahn Industries. I have another friend who graduated from Clemson who was in the top 5 Mortgage Brokers (by total $$$ financed) in the nation for Bank of America working out of Anderson, SC... averaging $83k a loan! He closed more than $20mil in loans in one year... and he did better than $10mil for 5yrs straight.
In conclusion, it is my opinion that you do not lose one iota of academic preparation going to Baruch or UNC Charlotte for your MFE. What you loose is the brand name, so you may not get that hedge fund or snotty IB straight out of school. However, if you are intelligent, hard working, and most importantly, enthusiastic, it is my sincere belief that you will equal or surpass those who expect life to give them something just because they graduated from XXXXXXX.
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Very nice story, Sam. Thanks for sharing with us.
I have serious flashback of Tom Cruise in Top Gun reading your stories about the Annapolis
I have serious flashback of Tom Cruise in Top Gun reading your stories about the Annapolis