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Difference between MFin & Financial Engineering

fshaikh

Joined
1/27/08
Messages
16
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11
I guys i am really trying to figure out the difference between Master of finance and Financial Engineering. What kind of jobs do you get with M.Fin and what kind of jobs do you get with Financial Engineering also what kind of jobs do you get with a MBA in finance. Whats the difference ?
Appreciate any responses
 
fshaikh said:
I guys i am really trying to figure out the difference between Master of finance and Financial Engineering. What kind of jobs do you get with M.Fin and what kind of jobs do you get with Financial Engineering also what kind of jobs do you get with a MBA in finance. Whats the difference ?
Appreciate any responses
Click to expand...

Generally, financial engineers look for quant jobs heavy in math and/or computer programming. They develop pricing models, trading strategies, etc and write software to test and implement them. They can be traders, portfolio managers, analysts, developers, etc.

MS Finance is for financial analysts, portfolio managers--jobs heavy in finance but not necessarily math. And generally no programming involved.

MBA's are for people with no idea of what they want to do. They go into a very broad field called "consulting", which is like saying your favorite thing to do is "stuff". They study useless subjects like Human Resources, Organizational Behavior, and their curriculum generally has about 10,000 different subjects packed into 2 year programs. So you leave with a little knowledge--most of it useless--in a lot of subjects. MBA's are one of the few graduate degrees where school and ranking matter, unfortunately. Probably because every school in the world has a program.

In all seriousness, you just have to get an idea of what kind of job you want, and then match your graduate studies accordingly. Do you want to be a trader? A programmer? A business analyst? A J. Crew model? You tell us, and then we can tell you the best type of program.

Hope that helps.
 
MikeK said:
MBA's are for people with no idea of what they want to do. They go into a very broad field called "consulting", which is like saying your favorite thing to do is "stuff". They study useless subjects like Human Resources, Organizational Behavior, and their curriculum generally has about 10,000 different subjects packed into 2 year programs. So you leave with a little knowledge--most of it useless--in a lot of subjects. MBA's are one of the few graduate degrees where school and ranking matter, unfortunately. Probably because every school in the world has a program.
Click to expand...

Mikek is a very nice guy. But I think he is biased this time. And I just want to be helpful here. I am sure Mikek understands :tiphat:

Human Resources, Organizational Behavior are usually electives in most top 20 programs. There are core courses that can be very useful, such as principle of marketing, marketing research, corporate finance, accounting, business policy/strategy, etc.

Some B-schools stand out in some areas. finance - Wharton. General managment (i.e., CEO eventually if you can go that far) - Harvard. There are of course many other top MAB programs.

Quant, to me, is an engineer. MBA...a lot of time they are the bosses. Sometime people go get a MBA after they become the boss. The knowledge you learn from MBA mostly are useful when you are mid-level upper. It is not really as hands-on as quant.

So if you do not have much working experience, a MBA degree uausally is not going to help you as much as quant training. When you become a manager (mid level and upper), you probably need a MBA for sure.

The brand value of a top 3 MBA (roughly) is several times of a second tier MBA. The brand itself opens a lot doors for you.

To my knowledge, there are only a few schools offer Master of finance.

Oh, by the way, I am not a MBA.
 
charlieLuo said:
Human Resources, Organizational Behavior are usually electives in most top 20 programs. There are core courses that can be very useful, such as principle of marketing, marketing research, corporate finance, accounting, business policy/strategy, etc.
Click to expand...

Many -- if not most -- MBA courses are fluff: human resources management, organisational behavior, marketing, psychology (if there is such an option), business statistics, business calculus, and I'm sure there are others. The real courses are financial accounting, managerial accounting, financial management and business policy/corporate strategy. An MBA with a finance specialisation means you go a but further, maybe even have a bit of exposure to risk analysis, derivatives, and so on. But nothing serious.
 
About the MBA.......
MBA is like a BBA ( Bachelor in business administration ) with basically the same courses but little bit advanced. The courses give you an Overview of how a company works and you can at the end specialise in Finance, accounting, HR etc.....I did a BBA , it's true that you learn things some are usefull (finance/Math:D courses of course ) others are completely useless ...What you learn at either a BBA or MBA level is not enough and very superficial...It was not enough for me I had to learn a lot of things by myself..
CharlieLuo you say that "The brand itself opens a lot doors for you." Yes of course but what about the content of the program? People should focuse more about what they learn and not on the brand name and rankings. That's only my opinion
To fshaikh : What is your background ? the question that you should ask yourself is : What Kind of Job do I want ? not which graduate program will give me which kind of job ?
Nahedhttp://www.quantnet.com/forum/member.php?u=3127
 
Well as far as background goes, i have a BSEE from OSU and an MSEE from SUNY-buffalo and always maintained a 3.5 GPA. I have about three years in automation industry and draw close to 80k at my present job in a not so expensive area. The only problem with my current job is the bureaucracy in promoting younger Engineers and also i am international, the place is not so diverse(deep south). Diversity to the company means black and women. I am just bored of south and want to move and live in NYC or CA. Its cool to be in Finance in NY as i dont think i can draw as much salary in NY being an EE , and i miss the mathematics aspect of EE which is what prompted me to explore other options and i think i just want to go and learn something different. Automation is boring :)

In the meanwhile, question for you Nahed- Are you desi ? i dont mean to offend you if you dont know what it means
 
most of the high paying jobs in automation are in Texas...South feels like its in the 1970's
 
No I'm not Desi..I did not know what it is ! checked wikipedia.
I'm Moroccan
 
fshaikh said:
I guys i am really trying to figure out the difference between Master of finance and Financial Engineering. What kind of jobs do you get with M.Fin and what kind of jobs do you get with Financial Engineering also what kind of jobs do you get with a MBA in finance. Whats the difference ?
Appreciate any responses
Click to expand...

M.Fin program, especially the M.Fin program @ Princeton, is essentially a quantitative finance program, but with more extensive tracks in addition to derivative pricing. (When we talk about the M.Fin program that can be compared to MFE@Berkeley/CMU/NewYork/Baruch/etc., I suppose that we are mainly concentrating on M.Fin @ Princeton).

Princeton's program introduces itself as a program that "teach all of finance", but in fact this program is a quantitative program. I like princeton's program because it provides more flexibility. Most MFE programs focus their attention on derivative pricing ---- they may have some courses about asset management, macrostructure forcasting, econometrics, but these courses are not the main concentration of the program --- I guess most MFE programs are designed to train quants for derivative pricing, who mainly use PDE, Stochastic calculus and C++.

But as far as I know, derivative pricing, PDE, Stochastic calculus and C++ are not the entire world of quantitative finance. I know that some quants in Hedge Funds don't use PDE/Stochastic calculus/C++ at all! So if you are not interested in this part (derivative pricing) of quantitative finance, maybe M.Fin is a better choice.

If you completely hate quantitative aspects of finance, go for a MBA.
 
echostate said:
M.Fin program, especially the M.Fin program @ Princeton, is essentially a quantitative finance program, but with more extensive tracks in addition to derivative pricing. (When we talk about the M.Fin program that can be compared to MFE@Berkeley/CMU/NewYork/Baruch/etc., I suppose that we are mainly concentrating on M.Fin @ Princeton).

Princeton's program introduces itself as a program that "teach all of finance", but in fact this program is a quantitative program. I like princeton's program because it provides more flexibility. Most MFE programs focus their attention on derivative pricing ---- they may have some courses about asset management, macrostructure forcasting, econometrics, but these courses are not the main concentration of the program --- I guess most MFE programs are designed to train quants for derivative pricing, who mainly use PDE, Stochastic calculus and C++.

But as far as I know, derivative pricing, PDE, Stochastic calculus and C++ are not the entire world of quantitative finance. I know that some quants in Hedge Funds don't use PDE/Stochastic calculus/C++ at all! So if you are not interested in this part (derivative pricing) of quantitative finance, maybe M.Fin is a better choice.

If you completely hate quantitative aspects of finance, go for a MBA.
Click to expand...

a plug here for Baruch's structured finance program. Dr. Raynes' two-semester structured finance course, encompasses study in economics, forecasting, engineering mathematics (no, I am not talking about financial engineering), monte carlo simulation, and yes philosophy & ethics. So Baruch's program is not only about PDE, stochastic calculus and C++.
 
Best program for a trader

MikeK said:
Generally, financial engineers look for quant jobs heavy in math and/or computer programming. They develop pricing models, trading strategies, etc and write software to test and implement them. They can be traders, portfolio managers, analysts, developers, etc.

MS Finance is for financial analysts, portfolio managers--jobs heavy in finance but not necessarily math. And generally no programming involved.

MBA's are for people with no idea of what they want to do. They go into a very broad field called "consulting", which is like saying your favorite thing to do is "stuff". They study useless subjects like Human Resources, Organizational Behavior, and their curriculum generally has about 10,000 different subjects packed into 2 year programs. So you leave with a little knowledge--most of it useless--in a lot of subjects. MBA's are one of the few graduate degrees where school and ranking matter, unfortunately. Probably because every school in the world has a program.

In all seriousness, you just have to get an idea of what kind of job you want, and then match your graduate studies accordingly. Do you want to be a trader? A programmer? A business analyst? A J. Crew model? You tell us, and then we can tell you the best type of program.

Hope that helps.
Click to expand...




Hi Mike

I want to be a trader. i am looking forward to do MS in finance from NYU. Is it a correct decision?
 
trader of what? Which market are looking to trade? how much capital?
 
Hey Andy. I am quite interested in the Global Macro Picture. So the natural place for me to start seems FX or Interest Rates desk but I'm still skeptical about MS Financial Engineering or MS International Business. As far as interests are concerned I am quite good with numbers coming from an engineering background but I love studying International Economics and Global Markets inter-relation.
 
Siddhartha Latwal said:
Hey Andy. I am quite interested in the Global Macro Picture. So the natural place for me to start seems FX or Interest Rates desk but I'm still skeptical about MS Financial Engineering or MS International Business. As far as interests are concerned I am quite good with numbers coming from an engineering background but I love studying International Economics and Global Markets inter-relation.
Click to expand...
Global Macro? Economics.
 
pingu said:
Global Macro? Economics.
Click to expand...
I meant the Macro Economic Analysis. But I have taken coursework in Statistics as well. I kinda like both of them. So Id like to know which among the two could be more marketable and helpful to me in better analyzing markets. So I'd really appreciate if you could help me clear the clutter and take an informed decision. (FYI Im a CFA L2 Candidate and I cleared the CFA L1 with top band score on all topic areas)
 
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