Introduction and question about age

[alain]

I don't think anphetamines was the cause of the issue. I happened to follow chess really closely at that time for a lot of reason (my dad plays a lot of chess and the best chess player in my country at that time was a friend of the family). That match was record breaking and Karpov was in really bad shape. Kasparov was coming back with a vengeance. I don't think anphetamines had anything to do with it.

Chess players use a lot of energy playing and analyzing positions before and after each games. Sometimes they just forget to eat completely. I've seen this first hand.

 

[IlyaKEightSix]

The fact is this: if anyone can do it, nobody makes money. Wall Street is a young man's game. Hell, Jaimie Dimon himself is barely in his 50s. There's something to be said for a fiery competitive spirit and vast loads of energy.

 

[luke]

He will be too old. Quant work -- like chess and mathematics -- is a young person's game. The young have the mental and physical stamina, the keenness of memory, and the speed of thought. A person over 50 can't live on 4 hours of sleep a day and not have his concentration and work suffer. The meticulous attention to detail that quant work requires will in any case not be there. Other than attention to detail, the speed of learning will be down, and the rate of forgetting will be higher. Let's be real and not dole out fake optimism. To give an example from chess, grandmasters over the age of 50 frequently faint at the board during the fifth hour of play -- and even before the fifth hour, their play suffers as they can't keep up the razor-sharp concentration that come effortlessly to players in their teens and twenties. With age come certain compensations -- learning short-cuts, learning how and where not to fritter away energy needlessly -- but they in no way make up for the drive and energy of youth.

Besides things like stamina, memory, agility of mind and physical strength, mathematical intuition is something that's best developed before you even become a teenager. People who have never been exposed to it will have a hard time even with courses in high school and college, much less quant work which are done by math phds.

Either way, I hope you are successful in your transition. It will not be easy but nothing is impossible. Good luck man.

 

[Stats CZ]

If you want to work at GS and make it big (I think that's your dream), you won't be sleeping 8 hours. I can't tell you that. So get used to sleep at most 6 hours. That will be trainning. You can mix it up with a 5 or 4 hours once in a while to see how your body responds... ah, and make sure you are sharp the following day. If not, what's the point? That's what the any job expects from you.

Wow, what will happen when a quant gets old?? A 50-year old probably has a hard time dealing with such a high energy job. Will a quant gradually transfer into a more senior and supervising level position, or he/she just simply has to quit and get a different job?

 

[bigbadwolf]

Will a quant gradually transfer into a more senior and supervising level position, or he/she just simply has to quit and get a different job?

A few lucky ones might but the thing about promotions is that it's a game of musical chairs: at each level there are more people than chairs, so people keep getting weeded and sifted out. For many of the most remunerative jobs today, you have to remember that it's not just about skill but about pressure and long hours. Lawyers, management consultants, and quants are all having to go through the same grind, knowing that many are called but few are chosen. Many people go into these areas with the realisation that in five or ten years they will be burnt out. The mind and body (let alone one's family and social life) can take only so much abuse. So they go in like marathon runners, knowing they will collapse at the end of the race, but wanting to have the highest ranking they can while they're competing. And hopefully, they'll have a tidy nest egg when they collapse.

These aren't "careers"; these are high-pressure jobs for which many highly-skilled people are competing, and which any person can do for only some time. After all, how long can you sprint?

 

[Stefan Zota]

Many people go into these areas with the realisation that in five or ten years they will be burnt out. The mind and body (let alone one's family and social life) can take only so much abuse. So they go in like marathon runners, knowing they will collapse at the end of the race, but wanting to have the highest ranking they can while they're competing

Fair statement and it can be extended to many other jobs on Wall Street. Even "business support" areas like pure technology will involve long hours and work during week-ends.
The environment is highly competitive. Other career paths can be summed up in a recipe, does not work for jobs where you have 300 applications for 3 positions.

So far the effort was worth it for people that were able to keep up the pace. The culture of investment banks is based on this full engagement from employees. It is expected to cover tasks that take at least 12 hours a day.
In the end, few people would survive more than 2 downturns in this environment (approximately 10 years)

 

[Stats CZ]

In the end, few people would survive more than 2 downturns in this environment (approximately 10 years)

Then what do they do? Is there a typical trend for them to switch to other job markets? I feel it is a loss for the business if most of the experienced people leave after 10 years. At least they can offer more seasoned thoughts and ideas. Are you talking about the norm in quant industry?

 

[bigbadwolf]

Then what do they do? Is there a typical trend for them to switch to other job markets? I feel it is a loss for the business if most of the experienced people leave after 10 years. At least they can offer more seasoned thoughts and ideas. Are you talking about the norm in quant industry?

A boxer aged forty-five has "experience," but he's not going to survive in the ring. In any case, the game of finance itself keeps changing so fast, it's questionable what the value of such "experience" would be.

In many professions today, the idea is pace oneself for early retirement (hopefully with a bank balance having at least six zeroes by that time). The old ideas of a "career," steady promotion, and a gold watch at retirement have long since evaporated.

Many of the quants on this forum don't even know if they'll have a job next year, let alone five or ten years down the road. And they know there are twenty others just like them wandering the streets looking for an opportunity.